Marilou Diaz-Abaya: What matters most is whom you loved (INTERVIEW)

During the last few years of her life, acclaimed film director Marilou Diaz-Abaya devoted herself to loving the people around her, and to sharing her passion for movies with the new generation of filmmakers. This was revealed in an interview that Diaz-Abaya had in January 2012 with GMA anchor Jessica Soho for the program "Kapuso Mo, Jessica Soho." During the interview, she admitted that she had long come to terms with the inevitability of death, something she even considered a blessing: "What cancer has given me ... is time. It has given me time to think about my mortality and what my life is worth. At the end of the day, what makes your life worth it is not so much what you’ve done but whom you loved," she shared with grace and courage. Diaz passed away on Oct. 8 after a long battle with breast cancer. She is best know for her critically-acclaimed films "Jose Rizal," "Muro-Ami," and "Bagong Buwan." GMA News Online is publishing the full transcript of her interview below.

Jessica Soho (JS): Direk, una po sa lahat, kumusta na ho kayo?

Marilou Diaz-Abaya (MDA): Today, I'm feeling well, and I'm so glad that you chose this date because any cancer survivor will tell you that no matter how well they’re coping with their treatments, there are good days and not so good days. But today happens to be a very good day and I'm glad that I'm spending the morning with you.

JS: Pero ano po ang diagnosis ng doctor?

MDA: I was first diagnosed with breast cancer, Stage 3, in January of 2007 so I spent most of 2007 in treatment. Then, I was on remission in 2008. I was able to read, write, teach and open my film school in Antipolo. Then in 2009, just when I accepted that Peňafrancia movie and it was time for me to research, immerse and write the screenplay, I had a recurrence. I said, “Oh Lord, what good timing!” because you know, this is the time that I'm supposed to be still and writing, and that’s what my body allowed me to do because I was in treatment the whole year of 2009. Noong time for production na, sabi ko, matapos ko man itong pelikula o hindi, kung hindi ako ang makatapos nito, I'm sure makakahanap si God ng iba na mas magaling sa akin. Basta, I just try to do what I can, you know, one step at a time. It turned out, ‘yung 2010, the whole year na nag-production ako, wala talagang recurrence tapos ‘yung pagkatapos na pagkatapos ng premiere, bale January 2011, nag-Stage 4 ako. Maraming nag-react. Direk bakit ganoon? Mahal na mahal niyo si Mama Mary; mahal na mahal niyo si Jesus. Bakit? In other words, they were devastated and they interpreted it as a kind of punishment. Ako naman, baliktad, sabi ko, “What better timing kasi tapos na yung Peňafrancia!” Tapos na ‘yung trabaho ko doon, so I said “What better timing than now? Maybe I'm being asked to do something else no.” But because I'm Stage 4, I was…well, medically there was basis to think that I would probably last three to six months, a few months there. The cancer spread from the breast to my liver, abdomen and my bones. After three regimens of chemo, talagang tumataas ‘yung tumor markers ko. For some reason, in May, bigla siyang nag-stop tapos bumagsak na up to mere normal levels. Of course, everyone’s happy, my family and my friends. Then I told the doctor, “Wala ito sa budget ko. Akala ko kasi sabi niyo go na ako. Pre-departure na ako. Hindi pa pala so I said, siguro may ipapagawa pa, hindi ba?” Baka gusto akong gawing sample na cancer is not death. There’s really no death. You’re just moving in transition from one stage to another. So I have good days. I have not so good days, but the not so good days, I don’t spend in pain. I don’t really have pain. It’s just antukin, laging nagugutom, batugan. I haven’t lost weight and the doctors are saying, “You’re supposed to exercise and lose some weight.” Anong magagawa ko? Lagi akong magana kumain.

JS: Di ba amazing na you can laugh about these things, na sinasabi mo that actually, you’re on extended time, which is very unusual? MDA: Yes. Pero alam mo, Jessica, noong una pang nakaramdam ako ng bukol sa dibdib ko at nagkonsulta ako sa doctor, ‘yung unang sinabi sa akin, “We’re looking at cancer.” Honestly, ‘yung unang-unang thought na pumasok sa isip ko is, “Oh my God! Thank you. I have time,” because I was thinking, you could go down the elevator and you could drop, and you wouldn’t have time to think about the people whom you still love, who still need you, and how to prepare for the inevitable, which is death. Also, I’ve been training. I'm an Ignatian Samurai, so I go on regular retreats every year. You really surrender. I wake up in the morning, and I think, “Ay, ginising ako ni Lord. Siguro may ipapagawa sa akin today.” I’ve learned to accept that life has passed. It’s not going to come back, but I can come back to it and relish it. I can share it. I can still enjoy it by remembering it. What’s in front of me right now is the challenge to trust in the goodness of life na it’s worth it. If I can love one person in a small way everyday, tama na sa akin ‘yun kaya hindi ako nafu-frustrate. Kaya lang, wina-warningan din ako ng mga priest friends ko, ng mga doctors ko, “Hinay-hinay sa mga joke-joke mo sa kamatayan.” Kasi noong November, nakatanggap ako ng imbitasyon. Dadating daw si Cecile Licad noong March so I responded to my friend because Cecile is my best friend.  I responded, “Sige. I hope I'm still alive by then.” I didn’t mean naman to cause him such distress, na-distress siya talaga, no. Pero it takes a lot of time. It takes a lot of work and it takes a lot of humility, I think. JS: But amazing talaga, Direk, na parang tanggap na tanggap niyo where you’re going. MDA: Well, I don’t know where I'm going, but I have to go sooner or later. Yes, I'm prepared anytime, anytime. If I lose my breath now, I know I'm holding my scapular. I know whose name will be on my lips, and I practice it ... Ready na e kung ano, para sa casket. Pinagawa ko na iyun noong January pa. JS: As in Direk, nakabilin na kung alin ‘yung isusuot niyo? M: Oo, andoon na. Nakasabit na ‘yun. JS: ‘Yung iba namimili ng, pasensya na kayo, coffin. You’ve gone through that too? MDA: On your birthday, you write your last wishes o kung ano ‘yung huling habilin, what you want to say to people you’re leaving behind. I do that every year. I specify there how simple I want the wake to be. Everything’s there. Twelve years ko nang ginagawa ‘yan. Alam mo, maraming tao ang nagsasabi, “Direk, fight! Direk, fight!” And I know what they mean. I know what they mean, and they always mean well. But I have a different kind of fight. I don’t really fight cancer. I befriended it. Ang fight, Jessica, is una, fear. ‘Yan ang fight kasi talagang tutuksuhin ka. Matutukso kang matakot. Matutukso kang mag-doubt. Tapos matutukso kang, ay naku, I won’t have this anymore, ‘yung mga attachments. Who will take care of my husband? Who will take care of my children? Well, actually you can lift it up. I don’t think that I can love my husband, my children, my family more than God can, so why can’t I lift and commend them to him? I pray for a peaceful death. So ‘yung tinatanong mo na kung handa, oo, vini-visualize ko pa nga, parang nanonood ako ng pelikula sabi ko para lang ready ako anytime. JS: The problem with directors is pati ‘yung mga kamatayan na-i-imagine, na-vi-visualize, Direk. MDA: Oo, e hindi ba nga noong pumanaw si Direk Ishmael Bernal, sa akin niya binigay ‘yung kanyang death papers e. Nakasulat talaga doon pati blocking. Ako ‘yung assistant director niya. Ayokong pumunta sa ospital noon. Tapos, talagang literally they had to carry me to the morgue kasi hindi sila makakilos hangga’t hindi ko buksan ‘yung last wishes niya kasi sa akin pinagbilin. Ay naku, mga direktor, hopeless ‘yan. Hanggang sa huli, i-di-direct na nila ‘yan. JS: So, Direk, which of the death scenes in your movies ‘yung nakaka-relate ka na gusto mong ma-visualize na ganoon din? Do you think of it that way na gusto kong mamatay, parang si ganyan? Any of the characters that you’ve directed? MDA: Well, hindi ko pa siya nadidirek pero alam mo lagi kong in-i-imagine. Ang model ko kasi si Mama Mary. Hindi naman siya nagkaroon ng painful death or what. Parang natulog lang siya tapos sinundo na siya ni Lord. And then the other thing, well I'm a big fan of St. Joseph, so he’s the patron saint of the sick and the dying. I have orders. If I go flatline, I am not to be resuscitated. You are not to put any unnatural or extraordinary machine or means to keep me alive artificially. And if possible, should they have to administer pain killers, it is for the purpose that I can pray for the last moment. JS: Hindi cinematic, Direk? MDA: Hindi. As a matter of fact, subtle kasi pagod na kaming mga director na magdirek ng mga naghihiyawan kapag may namamatay, but this is really the most natural, you know, the most natural human reaction. And then siguro, Jessica, nakakatulong din na I belong to a society of cancer survivors, and I have a lot of cancer buddies. You know, we meet regularly. We have activities together to trade stories and experiences, and to pat each other on the back, to attend each other’s funeral. In the last five years, marami akong practice, but I’d like to add to that na hindi mo natatanong is bago ako nagka-cancer kasi, napakapeligroso ng tatlong pelikulang ginawa ko. JS: Anu-ano ba, Direk? MDA: ’Yung “Jose Rizal”… JS: “Muro-ami”… MDA: “Jose Rizal”, my goodness, lagi kaming mayroong shooting kung saan-saang lupalop. I never know when an ambulance will be needed. Alam mo yun? You are dealing with life-threatening situations. And then, “Muro-ami”, literally, you know, literally it’s life and death. We have to keep alert to save lives. And then ‘yung “Bagong Buwan”, ‘yun, hindi biro kasi I was very much affected by the entire experience. So two years after that, the next picture I made, “Noon at Ngayon”, ‘yung karamdaman na in-assign ko sa pagsusulat ng character ni Laurice Guillen ay breast cancer. And a year after that, para bang hinanda yata ako, so I felt pampered na handa ako. Death is so inconvenient e and illness is so inconvenient especially in our fast-phased life. And I think, ironically, it’s what people miss out on. That in reflecting about your mortality, you actually can find quiet, a kind of grace na puwede mong isaalang-alang yung sarili mo. Let someone else take charge of you instead of you’re always the one na lang that’s taking care of yourself. JS: ‘Yun ang gusto kong tanungin, Direk, kasi ang mga direktor, they’re the worst control freaks. MDA: Oo, totoo. Hindi pwedeng ma-late ang aking staff and crew. JS: So noong nagka-cancer na po kayo, was it difficult to go from being a control freak to just being very surrendering and very submissive in a sense? MDA: Yes, yes, very much so. Although what helped me to prepare for it is that I'm a SCUBA diver. I'm a nature lover so the moment you’re in touch with nature, and you love cooperating with nature and surrendering yourself to the forces of nature, you already have an advantage. You realize you are not the center of the world. You are not always in control. And as a SCUBA diver and as a director, no matter how many trophies pa ‘yan, it grounds you. It humbles you e. I always recommend for directors to not get stuck directing because you’ll start believing in your own powers. And then you forget that this is not a movie only. This is about people, which is why I’ve been teaching, Jessica, for 32 years.  My students don’t always end up directing, but if they go to the bank and they become better bankers because of the craft they took, that’s alright. Noong time kasi namin noong nag-umpisa ako, talagang in control ang director. Bakit? Unang-una, aalis siya doon sa opisina ng producer. ‘Pag punta niya ng location, wala pa nga kaming, anong tawag ‘dun, beeper. Wala pa kaming beeper noon e. Lahat, de mano. Nakasulat. Such was the case that the producer had to entrust the entire enterprise to the director. At hindi siya basta-basta puwedeng pumunta doon sa set at sabihin, 'Gusto ko ‘yan, gusto ko ‘yan, ito ayoko.' The director enjoyed autonomy and authority. Noong nag-develop na ‘yung technology, aba nakakapanood na ‘yung producer ng playback, and then may opinion na ‘yung producer. The producer gained more control. So matagal nang nararamdaman ng director ‘yung pagbawas ng kanyang otoridad, ng kanyang otonomiya sa set. Noong nagkaroon ako ng cancer, hindi ko na-miss ‘yung pagiging direk sa set. Ang na-miss ko, ‘yung nasa set ako; maraming tao; marami kaming ginagawa; we’re enjoying and I was physically fit kasi I'm a buff. I mean, I love going to the gym. I love swimming. ‘Yun ‘yung talagang na-miss ko. I cannot just go to any public place. Maraming restrictions physically. The first two years of cancer, medyo I threw myself into reading, writing, teaching para maka-compensate. Kunwari pinapanood kita, “Oh, I wish I could do a documentary like that! Jessica is all over the place and I can’t do it.” But then I found it transformative. Instead of getting inggit, “Naku! Si Jessica nasa Zamboanga. Teritoryo ko ‘yan.” Nakikita kita. I wish I could do that, but physically impossible. Nag-transform siya. Imbis na naiinggit ako sa ‘yo, bumabakas ako sa likod mo. Pino-project ko na lang ‘yung sarili ko, “Ako yan. Ako yan. I could do that before.” JS: So nagiging vicarious, Direk? MDA: Yes. That’s why I love watching public affairs kasi that’s really what I miss most. ‘Yung entertainment kasi nagagawa, nase-setup ko pa ‘yan in my classrooms, in my studios. Pero ‘yung documentary hindi ko mase-setup ‘yun and I really, really miss it. I do. But it doesn’t bring me bad feelings, it brings back very fond memories. JS: Direk, you dive kahit na in between chemotherapy sessions? MDA: Yes, oo. JS: Paano niyo nagagawa ‘yun e di ba pag nagki-chemo, you feel so bad? MDA: ‘Yun na nga. For example no, mag-chemo ako ngayon. Let’s say, for example, the next two weeks, wala akong chemo. Dito sa week na ‘to bago ako mag-chemo ulit, diyan ako pinakamalakas so naka-timing diyan yung diving at ang kasama ko, oncologist ko, tsaka mga doktor. So yes, as a matter of fact, in the last five years, we’ve been to Bohol, mostly Bohol. I'm based in Anilao e. So kasi ‘yung tubig, unang-una, sorry ha, medyo overweight ako, so ‘yung ano... JS: Buoyancy… MDA: Oo, ‘yung sensation ng nasa tubig na nakaganyan ka lang. Naku! It’s so nice and I really love swimming. And then, I'm encouraged to exercise talaga for my cardiopulmonary health, wellness. Then actually, ngayon nasa physical rehab ako e. They’re trying to rebuild my stamina. Kasi you know, ‘yung regular chemo, mga six to eight cycles lang ‘yun e. Ako, since first week of February 2011, non-stop up to now. That’s a whole year. JS: So most of the time, Direk, hindi mo talaga iniisip yung cancer? MDA: Hindi, iniisip ko, because there are lot of people with whom I have to discuss it. Those who counsel me, those whom I counsel, those whom I share with. And then nakakabagabag dahil it’s just like an epidemic, ‘yung cancer ... the friend of mine or the sister or people I know, and people I don’t know, and they’re in their 40s. JS: So many reminders… MDA: Yes, and then it’s quickly becoming the number one killer worldwide, more na than cardio [disease]. I said … well, our communities are thinking beyond the genetics, beyond the lifestyle, et cetera. It’s environmental na yata, you know. Lagi akong inspired; lagi akong excited ‘pag may nakakausap ako na alam ko, it makes kahit na a little difference to her or to him, and also to me. ‘Yung mahirap, ‘yung pinakamahirap, is how do you comfort the parents of children who have cancer? The children are easier to comfort e. It’s the families of the children, especially with the 12 and below, those who have leukemia. Ang hirap. And we have very few qualified to give comfort ba, to give relief. At saka ang mahal, Jessica, so that means ‘yung indigent patient will have to go through the chemo without the sweeteners, ‘yung anti-nausea. Wala na siyang iba pang luxury and they suffer the most. JS: So, Direk, you have cancer, but you dive. Nagtuturo kayo? MDA: Oo, nagsusulat ng libro with Ricky Lee. JS: Nagka-counsel … ano pang ginagawa niyo? Ang dami niyong ginagawa. MDA: Natutulog din ako. Madalas din akong maantok. Hindi, let’s put it this way. Noon, nakakapagplano ako. Year 2012, di ba plano tayo ng ganyan? Ngayon, by months na lang so parang may warranty ako by month. Every three weeks, they’re getting my lab test so I know whether I'm going to backslide or not. So obviously, there are things I really have to let go. Certainty is one, and the feeling of security is the other because you will never know. It can come back tomorrow; it can come back the next day. You just have to be prepared. So I am, like I’ve mentioned earlier, nandoon na ko sa puntong paggising ko sa umaga, okay, kumusta ‘yung katawan ko? Okay, today will be a good. Thank you, Lord, I meet Jessica at 11, ganoon, tapos I can plan na the day. Then I can plan a little bit for the next day and the week, ganoon na lang. It’s very humbling. It’s really very humbling. JS: As in you really live one day at a time? MDA: Yes, literally, literally one day at a time. JS: Biggest lesson, Direk, na natutunan niyo? MDA: Love, oo, love talaga in all its forms kasi you tend to take love for granted. I love you, I love you, yeah, but what we take for granted is we don’t show it enough and most of the time, it’s because we don’t have enough time. And what cancer has given me as I mentioned, first thing, is time. It has given me time to think about my mortality and what my life is worth and what I can make it pa. It has refocused my attention more on the things, essential things. You’re choosing essentials. You are now concentrating on values, di ba? And usually, you will find na kung alam mong it’s only a matter of time, that may taning ka sa buhay mo, the tendency honestly, is not to get more. The tendency is give away, give away, give away. Kaya nga ako nagtuturo kasi sabi ko, Ricardo, Ricky Lee, ituro na natin lahat ng alam ko kasi ayokong dalhin ito. Sinong gagamit nito? Oo, that’s why we continue to teach. ‘Yung love for strangers which I didn’t really experience before, but to be able to love someone whom you don’t know, only because that person is a human being like you, you know. At the end of the day, what makes your life worth it is not so much what you’ve done but whom you loved. It’s the who. It’s not the what you did, or what you got, or what you accomplished, where you went. It’s really whom you loved. I think at the end of the day, it’s really going to be about that. And that’s not mortal. It’s a gift, which we don’t deserve but which was given to us anyway gratuitously di ba? Ang resolution naman diyan is, okay, Marilou, be kind to people who are not yet prepared to talk about death and stop joking about it. JS: Pero, Direk, when they say Marilou Diaz-Abaya, they will always remember you for the classics or the movies that you’ve directed like “Rizal”, “Muro-ami”... MDA: Naku, thank you. GMA ‘yan. Oo, “Muro Ami." JS: Wala nang gaganda pa diyan sa “Rizal” movie na 'yan… MDA: Naku naman, Jessica, you know kung anong nakakakilig sa akin? Naku! Hay, I just cross my leg, papaypay-paypay nang ganyan sa campus o kung nanonood ako ng TV, papaypay-paypay sa dami ng estudyanteng tinuruan ko. ‘Yung kinikilig talaga ako ‘pag nakikita ‘yung pangalan nila at kung kumukuha na sila ng mga trophies nila. Talagang kinikilig ako. That’s the biggest kilig! To begin with, my two sons were in my classes e, so they were also my students and they are also doing films now. And ‘yan, everybody from Jeffrey Jeturian down to Jun Lana was also you know, my student. I mentored them. So ‘yun, ‘yung feeling mo na may saysay ka kasi doon sa pagmamahal mo sa iba, may maiiwan ka, may maipapamana sa kanila. Kilig na kilig ako sa students, so when you just said now, oo, na wala nang makakagawa niyan. Oo, kasi iba na ang gagawin nila. Nasa digital na sila ngayon. They have new archetypes. They have new heroes. They have new ways of telling things, and I'm just so thrilled. I'm so excited to find out how they will reinvent entertainment and the industry. I mean the documentaries that are being done today are very, very far from what we were so restricted from doing…Hindi, bata ka pa, early ‘80s. JS: I was already working, Direk. MDA: You were working pero sini-censor pa tayo noon. Hanggang 1983, sini-censor pa tayo. JS: Do you feel you’ve done the best movies na dapat mong gawin in your life? MDA: Actually, when I was preparing the Peňafrancia movie, I had in my heart, my mind that I would like to go with the Peňafrancia movie as my swan song. And then, totally give way, you know, so that the students whom I taught and the new generation will not only feel free but actually be really free to reinvent, to do something more than what my generation did. And sana ‘yung mga pagkukulang namin mapuno ng bagong generation. And after all, kami noon kapag mag-re-research, pupunta pa ng library. Ngayon, half of your work, i-Google mo lang, okay na e. So ang sinasabi ko sa mga estudyante ko, may Google na tayo. Information is not our problem. Insight is the problem. We need insight, but to get insight, you need not only academic research, social research, you need to immerse. Sabi ko, “You really have to be there, or you won’t be able to do anything more significant than what have already been done.” I hope the Internet does not make them lazy to go out, but I'm very happy. I’m very optimistic even, you know, even though I know there are so many challenges in this new age, the digital age. Noong isang araw, medyo nag-senti-senti ako kasi I was reminded by my husband na starting this year, they’re all going computer and digital, na so I said, “Ay, lumipas na talaga.” Pero when I was examining myself, I didn’t feel bad. I just felt sentimental and nostalgic. And then as I said, “Ninamnam ko ‘yung good memories.” Ninamnam ko, and then kung kanino ko ma-share, kung sinong gustong makinig kasi madaldal ako, that’s more than enough for me. JS: Thank you very much, Direk. MDA: You’re very much welcome. I enjoyed it. What a good way to start the day.